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Thread: Wahhabist Islam

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    Default Wahhabist Islam

    What are your opinions of Wahhabism in the Islamic world? From my understanding, it is a religious movement within Islam that is extremely intolerant, aggressive, and fanatic. It is tied to the Saudi government from it's earliest history and is the dominant theory among Islamic terrorists.
    "The exploited are not carriers of any positive project, be it even the classless society (which all too closely resembles the productive set up). Capital is their only community. They can only escape by destroying everything that makes them exploited...Capitalism has not created the conditions of its overcoming in communism-the famous bourgeoisie forging the arms of its own extinction-but of a world of horrors." -At Daggers Drawn

    "Our strategy is therefore the following: to establish and maintain a series of centers of desertion, or poles of secession, of rallying points. For runaways. For those who leave. A series of places where we can escape from the influence of a civilization that is headed for the abyss." -Tiqqun, Call

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    Inherently anti-modern and reactionary, but a reaction to rampant imperialism in the Islamic world
    'So we must fly a rebel flag, As others did before us, And we must sing a rebel song, And join in rebel chorus.

    We'll make the tyrants feel the sting, O' those that they would throttle;, They needn't say the fault is ours, If blood should stain the wattle!"

    - Henry Lawson

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ned Kelly View Post
    Inherently anti-modern and reactionary, but a reaction to rampant imperialism in the Islamic world
    I completely agree.
    "The exploited are not carriers of any positive project, be it even the classless society (which all too closely resembles the productive set up). Capital is their only community. They can only escape by destroying everything that makes them exploited...Capitalism has not created the conditions of its overcoming in communism-the famous bourgeoisie forging the arms of its own extinction-but of a world of horrors." -At Daggers Drawn

    "Our strategy is therefore the following: to establish and maintain a series of centers of desertion, or poles of secession, of rallying points. For runaways. For those who leave. A series of places where we can escape from the influence of a civilization that is headed for the abyss." -Tiqqun, Call

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    Well, I'm coming from a country which continues to suffer greatly from Wahhabi militants, so it won't be hard to guess my opinion on them. As of today, the situation with Wahhabism is the worst in Dagestan, which is dangerously close to a full-scale civil war. According to some sources, Wahhabist movements also grow at alarming rate in the historically Muslim regions of Middle Volga and some regions in Siberia, but I hope it won't go too far.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ned Kelly View Post
    Inherently anti-modern and reactionary, but a reaction to rampant imperialism in the Islamic world
    In some cases, yes, but not in every case. (On the part about being a; 'reaction to imperialism', not the; 'inherently anti-modern and reactionary' part, which is spot-on.)
    [FONT=Verdana]Economic Left/Right: -7.25
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    "Kick over the wall 'cause government's to fall,
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    D'you know that you can use it?"-The Clash, "Clampdown"

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    Question Doesn't Wahhabist Islam view the Sunni ?

    Doesn't Wahhabist Islam view the Sunni as the true Muslims and the Shia as not being true Muslims ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anti-Capitalist View Post
    What are your opinions of Wahhabism in the Islamic world? From my understanding, it is a religious movement within Islam that is extremely intolerant, aggressive, and fanatic. It is tied to the Saudi government from it's earliest history and is the dominant theory among Islamic terrorists.
    it is tied to the saudi government but the dominant ideology among islamists is generally based off qutb of the egyptian muslim brotherhood not so much the saudi wahabbi which is hostile to the 'jihadists.' in pakistan and afghanistan a lot of militants come from deobandi backgrounds.
    'heavens above, how awful it is to live outside the law - one is always expecting what one rightly deserves.'
    petronius, the satyricon

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    Quote Originally Posted by tradeunionsupporter View Post
    Doesn't Wahhabist Islam view the Sunni as the true Muslims and the Shia as not being true Muslims ?
    It is a section of Sunni Islam but differs from it and views all non-Wahhabists as enemies, whether Sunni or Shia.
    "The exploited are not carriers of any positive project, be it even the classless society (which all too closely resembles the productive set up). Capital is their only community. They can only escape by destroying everything that makes them exploited...Capitalism has not created the conditions of its overcoming in communism-the famous bourgeoisie forging the arms of its own extinction-but of a world of horrors." -At Daggers Drawn

    "Our strategy is therefore the following: to establish and maintain a series of centers of desertion, or poles of secession, of rallying points. For runaways. For those who leave. A series of places where we can escape from the influence of a civilization that is headed for the abyss." -Tiqqun, Call

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    Wahhabists are the scum children of imperialism.

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    Wahhabism is becoming a lot more common throughout the so-called "Arab World". The Saudis are able to take advantage of the fact that many countries like Pakistan have terrible educational infrastructure and funding, and set up Wahhabist religious schools, which are subsidized.

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    Wahhabism isn't only a religious movement, it has been the official religious-political ideology of the Saudis since the 18th century. It began with the alliance between the Mohammed bin Saud and al-Wahhab(by the way, all political and religious power in Saudi Arabia is still in the hands of their descendents, the religious elite, the clergy, in Saudi Arabia is made up of mostly al-Wahhab's descendents by his 5 surviving sons, and the political power is still in the hands of the House of Saud), Wahhabism has been the state ideology of the Saudis since then, it never was a "reaction" to Imperialism, it was a justification for Saudi conquest of the Arabian peninsula.

    Anyways, Wahhabism doesn't really exist outside of Saudi Arabia. The "Islamists", "terrorists", etc, outside of Saudi Arabia are Salafis(Wahhabism can be said to be a branch of Salafism), like the Muslim Brotherhood, though their funding comes mainly from Saudi Wahhabis.

    Quote Originally Posted by B.K. View Post
    Well, I'm coming from a country which continues to suffer greatly from Wahhabi militants, so it won't be hard to guess my opinion on them. As of today, the situation with Wahhabism is the worst in Dagestan, which is dangerously close to a full-scale civil war. According to some sources, Wahhabist movements also grow at alarming rate in the historically Muslim regions of Middle Volga and some regions in Siberia, but I hope it won't go too far.
    Indeed. Funnily enough, this Wahhabism was imported by the Russian State and all the major Wahhabis in Chechnya were on the payroll of the Russian State, they were used to discredit the Chechen separatists. But still, traditional Caucasian Sufism still dominates in the Caucasus.

    Quote Originally Posted by tradeunionsupporter View Post
    Doesn't Wahhabist Islam view the Sunni as the true Muslims and the Shia as not being true Muslims ?
    All Sunnis view Shias as apostates and heretics. The Ottomans thought that killing a Shia gives you more heaven-points than killing a Christian or a pagan. Sunnis have been slaughtering and persecuting Shias since way before the Westerners invented slaughtering and persecuting Jews. And it's not only the Arabs and Turks that are very keen on the whole "Shias are heretic dogs" thing, persecution of Shias by Sunnis on the grounds that Shias are apostates has been going on even in India, Indonesia and China.

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    My understanding is that it's something that should have been wiped off the face of the Earth the day the Saudis interfered with the Glorious Socialist Liberation of Afghanistan and Emancipation of Her Women.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Borz View Post

    All Sunnis view Shias as apostates and heretics. The Ottomans thought that killing a Shia gives you more heaven-points than killing a Christian or a pagan. Sunnis have been slaughtering and persecuting Shias since way before the Westerners invented slaughtering and persecuting Jews. And it's not only the Arabs and Turks that are very keen on the whole "Shias are heretic dogs" thing, persecution of Shias by Sunnis on the grounds that Shias are apostates has been going on even in India, Indonesia and China.
    i don't remember a time were Shi'ite were slaughtered by Sunni except in the beginning of Shi'ite ( 7 century ) , back then the Shi'ite were more like a political power than religious one , back then they were religiously the same

    religious fanatics groups \ nations rarely exist in arabs history


    Muslims in medieval tolerated many ''sins'' ,
    *Drinking , the caliphate themselves were drunkard
    *homosexuality :Abu nawas , famous poet for his poets about wine , but got was bisexual , many of his poets indicates that . He would be tortured to death in modern Saudi Arabia . worth mentioning that caliph almaamoun did appoint a gay judge as the highest judge in the caliphate
    *Sexual activities : well actually i got some PDF books version to my Favorite Imam ( religious occupation ) al suyuti , about human sexuality , if a religious guy was able to do that , you could imagine how the general populations acts
    worth mentioning al herrif Ibn houkayma , great poets , whining about his dysfunctional penis i don't believe this guy would survive in current SAudi
    *Atheism : well some philosophical groups denying the existence of faith were around , Alrazi , one of the most distinguished arab physicians was atheist and even wrote books calling Mohamed a fake prophet . Avicenna , probably the most important medical figure in the medieval ages publicly deny the existence of human soul , and criticized heavily islamic Imams , died naturally



    anyway this wave of fanatics are unseen in arab history . Nietzsche used great expression : metaphysical comfort : which exactly what happening now , as shittier your life get , the more you will need stuff to let you forget it religion act as drugs . i believe that what's the term (religion the opium of the people means ) such as the rise of religious extremists in recession , or Dark ages ( as arabs now )


    someone mentioned here war on islam by westerns . it's complete crap may i say . as the greatest arab Ally of USA , is Saudi arabia . USA-islamist alliance happened many times before
    *Saudi arabia
    *muslim brotherhood support against Nasser and the free officer regime in Egypt . Nasser is someone comparable to Chavez nowdays
    *Al mujaheddin in Afghanistan
    *Muslim brotherhood after arab spring

    wahhabist islam is a tool of Saudi arabia (which is a USA puppet ) many times employed by it to serves imperialist goals . it's probably the most regressive form of Islam ever happened in his history

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    Quote Originally Posted by wsg1991 View Post
    i don't remember a time were Shi'ite were slaughtered by Sunni except in the beginning of Shi'ite ( 7 century ) , back then the Shi'ite were more like a political power than religious one , back then they were religiously the same

    religious fanatics groups \ nations rarely exist in arabs history


    Muslims in medieval tolerated many ''sins'' ,
    *Drinking , the caliphate themselves were drunkard
    *homosexuality :Abu nawas , famous poet for his poets about wine , but got was bisexual , many of his poets indicates that . He would be tortured to death in modern Saudi Arabia . worth mentioning that caliph almaamoun did appoint a gay judge as the highest judge in the caliphate
    *Sexual activities : well actually i got some PDF books version to my Favorite Imam ( religious occupation ) al suyuti , about human sexuality , if a religious guy was able to do that , you could imagine how the general populations acts
    worth mentioning al herrif Ibn houkayma , great poets , whining about his dysfunctional penis i don't believe this guy would survive in current SAudi
    *Atheism : well some philosophical groups denying the existence of faith were around , Alrazi , one of the most distinguished arab physicians was atheist and even wrote books calling Mohamed a fake prophet . Avicenna , probably the most important medical figure in the medieval ages publicly deny the existence of human soul , and criticized heavily islamic Imams , died naturally



    anyway this wave of fanatics are unseen in arab history . Nietzsche used great expression : metaphysical comfort : which exactly what happening now , as shittier your life get , the more you will need stuff to let you forget it religion act as drugs . i believe that what's the term (religion the opium of the people means ) such as the rise of religious extremists in recession , or Dark ages ( as arabs now )


    someone mentioned here war on islam by westerns . it's complete crap may i say . as the greatest arab Ally of USA , is Saudi arabia . USA-islamist alliance happened many times before
    *Saudi arabia
    *muslim brotherhood support against Nasser and the free officer regime in Egypt . Nasser is someone comparable to Chavez nowdays
    *Al mujaheddin in Afghanistan
    *Muslim brotherhood after arab spring

    wahhabist islam is a tool of Saudi arabia (which is a USA puppet ) many times employed by it to serves imperialist goals . it's probably the most regressive form of Islam ever happened in his history
    Indeed, prior to the Islamic Revival or Islamic Awakening, the Islamic world was somewhat secular. Indonesia was quite modern, with few men and women wearing traditional Islamic clothing, for example. Today, 99% of Indonesia's population says "religion is very important".

    In my view, the Islamic Revival is a reaction to the failure of socialism. It gives the working class hope, but of course this hope is senseless. And as soon as the working classes see that it is hopeless and that Islamism has not and cannot improve their lives, they will--hopefully--turn to socialism (or otherwise liberalism).
    pew pew pew

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Cornelis View Post
    Indeed, prior to the Islamic Revival or Islamic Awakening, the Islamic world was somewhat secular. Indonesia was quite modern, with few men and women wearing traditional Islamic clothing, for example. Today, 99% of Indonesia's population says "religion is very important".

    In my view, the Islamic Revival is a reaction to the failure of socialism. It gives the working class hope, but of course this hope is senseless. And as soon as the working classes see that it is hopeless and that Islamism has not and cannot improve their lives, they will--hopefully--turn to socialism (or otherwise liberalism).
    we got several petty bourgeois nationalists which are social democrat (economically speaking ) and anti-imperialist , and hostile to big business at best (nationalizing top corporation \ foreign assets )
    but did identify themselves as socialists , thus any achievement they produce adds to the reputation of socialism
    , no real communists movements as , as communist failed miserably to achieve any populist form , first duo to refusal to support national liberation movements (they are cured from that now ) and because there labeled as atheist

    there failure appears at best at workers unions . i read an article here when the writer point at that in workers protests in the 60ies in Jordan carry on Nasser's photo , and not a single photo for Marx , Lenin ...

    secondly in recent worker's union here the new election here the new election leader and officials are mostly nationalists

    thirdly the recent Egyptian election , Hamdeen subahi , a nasserist , came a close third ,


    if something Leftist should focus is how to achieve any populist form , how to reaches the desperate uneducated masses .
    a important facts you should remember is the percentage of voters , that's gives an idea about the level of satisfaction

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