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  #61  
Old 28th September 2004, 15:34
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YKTMX YKTMX is offline
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Not only that, but you can't be a Christian unless you accept the bodily resurrection of Christ.
Yes.

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Whenever Leninists run into the obvious contradictions between Marx and Lenin, they fall back on mere assertion
No.

Quote:
It's true "because we say so".
Yes.

Quote:
That's speculative at best. And entirely irrelevant now since both are dead.
Strange. Since when did History (particuraly socialist revolutionary History) become irrelevant?

Although, in your defense, disregarding History does help when "re-thinking" the Communist project eh?

Quote:
And at the 10th Party Congress (March 1921) he "tightened" them right back up again...even though the civil war had been won.
The revolution was becoming increasingly isolated and events like Kronstadt definetly shook the regime. The Bolsheviks made some mistakes at this time, I have no reason to dispute that.
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Since, according to their fantasy, the relationships of men, all their doings, their chains and their limitations are products of their consciousness, the Young Hegelians logically put to men the moral postulate of exchanging their present consciousness for human, critical or egoistic consciousness, and thus of removing their limitations. This demand to change consciousness amounts to a demand to interpret reality in another way, i.e. to recognise it by means of another interpretation. The Young-Hegelian ideologists, in spite of their allegedly "world-shattering" statements, are the staunchest conservatives.

Karl Marx
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  #62  
Old 28th September 2004, 15:34
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YKTMX YKTMX is offline
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Quote:
Not only that, but you can't be a Christian unless you accept the bodily resurrection of Christ.
Yes.

Quote:
Whenever Leninists run into the obvious contradictions between Marx and Lenin, they fall back on mere assertion
No.

Quote:
It's true "because we say so".
Yes.

Quote:
That's speculative at best. And entirely irrelevant now since both are dead.
Strange. Since when did History (particuraly socialist revolutionary History) become irrelevant?

Although, in your defense, disregarding History does help when "re-thinking" the Communist project eh?

Quote:
And at the 10th Party Congress (March 1921) he "tightened" them right back up again...even though the civil war had been won.
The revolution was becoming increasingly isolated and events like Kronstadt definetly shook the regime. The Bolsheviks made some mistakes at this time, I have no reason to dispute that.
__________________
Since, according to their fantasy, the relationships of men, all their doings, their chains and their limitations are products of their consciousness, the Young Hegelians logically put to men the moral postulate of exchanging their present consciousness for human, critical or egoistic consciousness, and thus of removing their limitations. This demand to change consciousness amounts to a demand to interpret reality in another way, i.e. to recognise it by means of another interpretation. The Young-Hegelian ideologists, in spite of their allegedly "world-shattering" statements, are the staunchest conservatives.

Karl Marx
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  #63  
Old 28th September 2004, 15:34
YKTMX's Avatar
YKTMX YKTMX is offline
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Default
Quote:
Not only that, but you can't be a Christian unless you accept the bodily resurrection of Christ.
Yes.

Quote:
Whenever Leninists run into the obvious contradictions between Marx and Lenin, they fall back on mere assertion
No.

Quote:
It's true "because we say so".
Yes.

Quote:
That's speculative at best. And entirely irrelevant now since both are dead.
Strange. Since when did History (particuraly socialist revolutionary History) become irrelevant?

Although, in your defense, disregarding History does help when "re-thinking" the Communist project eh?

Quote:
And at the 10th Party Congress (March 1921) he "tightened" them right back up again...even though the civil war had been won.
The revolution was becoming increasingly isolated and events like Kronstadt definetly shook the regime. The Bolsheviks made some mistakes at this time, I have no reason to dispute that.
__________________
Since, according to their fantasy, the relationships of men, all their doings, their chains and their limitations are products of their consciousness, the Young Hegelians logically put to men the moral postulate of exchanging their present consciousness for human, critical or egoistic consciousness, and thus of removing their limitations. This demand to change consciousness amounts to a demand to interpret reality in another way, i.e. to recognise it by means of another interpretation. The Young-Hegelian ideologists, in spite of their allegedly "world-shattering" statements, are the staunchest conservatives.

Karl Marx
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  #64  
Old 28th September 2004, 19:38
DaCuBaN DaCuBaN is offline
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Whenever Leninists run into the obvious contradictions between Marx and Lenin, they fall back on mere assertion
I can't believe you quoted that, given the answers you gave... Nail...Head...Bang!
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Adiel: How can you defend a country where 5 percent of the people control 95 percent of the wealth?
Lisa: I'm defending a country where people can think and act and worship any way they want!
Adiel: Cannot!
Lisa: Can to!
Adiel: Cannot!
Lisa: Can to!
Homer: Please, please, kids; stop fighting. Maybe Lisa is right about America being the land of opportunity, maybe Adiel has a point about the machinery of capitalism being oiled with the blood of the workers.
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  #65  
Old 28th September 2004, 19:38
DaCuBaN DaCuBaN is offline
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Whenever Leninists run into the obvious contradictions between Marx and Lenin, they fall back on mere assertion
I can't believe you quoted that, given the answers you gave... Nail...Head...Bang!
__________________
Adiel: How can you defend a country where 5 percent of the people control 95 percent of the wealth?
Lisa: I'm defending a country where people can think and act and worship any way they want!
Adiel: Cannot!
Lisa: Can to!
Adiel: Cannot!
Lisa: Can to!
Homer: Please, please, kids; stop fighting. Maybe Lisa is right about America being the land of opportunity, maybe Adiel has a point about the machinery of capitalism being oiled with the blood of the workers.
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  #66  
Old 28th September 2004, 19:38
DaCuBaN DaCuBaN is offline
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Default
Quote:
Whenever Leninists run into the obvious contradictions between Marx and Lenin, they fall back on mere assertion
I can't believe you quoted that, given the answers you gave... Nail...Head...Bang!
__________________
Adiel: How can you defend a country where 5 percent of the people control 95 percent of the wealth?
Lisa: I'm defending a country where people can think and act and worship any way they want!
Adiel: Cannot!
Lisa: Can to!
Adiel: Cannot!
Lisa: Can to!
Homer: Please, please, kids; stop fighting. Maybe Lisa is right about America being the land of opportunity, maybe Adiel has a point about the machinery of capitalism being oiled with the blood of the workers.
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  #67  
Old 28th September 2004, 19:53
Xvall Xvall is offline
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That belief is wrong. Bakunin said that command was "sustained" by the people. Sustained means directly supported, there's no getting away from it.
No, to 'sustain' is to keep something alive that would normally collapse on its own. It doesn't necessarily mean that whatever is 'sustaining' something is in 'direct support' for it. You can sustain something without supporting it; you can sustain something without even knowing that you are sustaining it.

Quote:
The people of Salem weren't "born" stupid. They acted ignorantly because of various reasons, nothing to do with personal faults of character.
Likewise, the average American isn't born stupid - the American media and religion, however, makes sure to correct these things. I never said that the people of Salem were born stupid; I specifically pointed out that the fault lied directly in the people who orchestrated these thing.

Quote:
Stop trying to defend it, it's pointless.
No.
__________________
<span style=\'font-family:Arial\'>11:18 am, Greenwich Mean Time, December 21, 2012 AD.
&quot;If you're talking about Xvall, I think it is some date when the world is supposed to get sucked into some blackhole or some crazy shit like that.&quot; - Fist of Blood
&quot;Einstein was a sick pervert, E=mC2 MY ARSE! pROVE IT U RED SWINE&quot; - Bugalu Shrimp</span>
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  #68  
Old 28th September 2004, 19:53
Xvall Xvall is offline
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Default
Quote:
That belief is wrong. Bakunin said that command was "sustained" by the people. Sustained means directly supported, there's no getting away from it.
No, to 'sustain' is to keep something alive that would normally collapse on its own. It doesn't necessarily mean that whatever is 'sustaining' something is in 'direct support' for it. You can sustain something without supporting it; you can sustain something without even knowing that you are sustaining it.

Quote:
The people of Salem weren't "born" stupid. They acted ignorantly because of various reasons, nothing to do with personal faults of character.
Likewise, the average American isn't born stupid - the American media and religion, however, makes sure to correct these things. I never said that the people of Salem were born stupid; I specifically pointed out that the fault lied directly in the people who orchestrated these thing.

Quote:
Stop trying to defend it, it's pointless.
No.
__________________
<span style=\'font-family:Arial\'>11:18 am, Greenwich Mean Time, December 21, 2012 AD.
&quot;If you're talking about Xvall, I think it is some date when the world is supposed to get sucked into some blackhole or some crazy shit like that.&quot; - Fist of Blood
&quot;Einstein was a sick pervert, E=mC2 MY ARSE! pROVE IT U RED SWINE&quot; - Bugalu Shrimp</span>
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  #69  
Old 28th September 2004, 19:53
Xvall Xvall is offline
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Location: Illinois, Chicago Area
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Xvall is on a distinguished road
Send a message via ICQ to Xvall Send a message via AIM to Xvall
Default
Quote:
That belief is wrong. Bakunin said that command was "sustained" by the people. Sustained means directly supported, there's no getting away from it.
No, to 'sustain' is to keep something alive that would normally collapse on its own. It doesn't necessarily mean that whatever is 'sustaining' something is in 'direct support' for it. You can sustain something without supporting it; you can sustain something without even knowing that you are sustaining it.

Quote:
The people of Salem weren't "born" stupid. They acted ignorantly because of various reasons, nothing to do with personal faults of character.
Likewise, the average American isn't born stupid - the American media and religion, however, makes sure to correct these things. I never said that the people of Salem were born stupid; I specifically pointed out that the fault lied directly in the people who orchestrated these thing.

Quote:
Stop trying to defend it, it's pointless.
No.
__________________
<span style=\'font-family:Arial\'>11:18 am, Greenwich Mean Time, December 21, 2012 AD.
&quot;If you're talking about Xvall, I think it is some date when the world is supposed to get sucked into some blackhole or some crazy shit like that.&quot; - Fist of Blood
&quot;Einstein was a sick pervert, E=mC2 MY ARSE! pROVE IT U RED SWINE&quot; - Bugalu Shrimp</span>
Reply With Quote
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